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Comments on Where do the ToS draw the line regarding what a spam account is?

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Where do the ToS draw the line regarding what a spam account is?

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The general policy on spam accounts with advertisements stored in their user profile (and no account activity) was already discussed here.

I´m looking at an account whose current advertisement method within our network is literally their distinct account name only.

To gain search engine attention, this account would also sometimes post a low quality [also plagiarized, but please let's pretend, for the sake of this policy question, that this is not always the case] answer, sometimes without even checking whether the victim question did not already have their own previous answer, thus demonstrating their disregard for the nominal content of their own answer posts.

In the past, they also tended to put a hyperlink from a random word in their answer post pointing to their eponymous company website, but they desisted from that since, after a formal warning.

There is also a comment thread touching on some aspects of this interaction. If that comment thread does not lead to any meaningful conversation regarding the authorship, goals and value of their contribution, I will tend to think that this account's sole purpose is building brand awareness, unrelated to the purpose of our site, and possibly handle it as a spam account.

I believe that "creating an account just to post spam" is grounds for account termination.

Out of curiousity, is there any specific ToS rule that "creating an account just to post spam" would be violating?

For the purpose of this question, please assume that all content ever posted by the account (except for the former hyperlinks) can be construed as at least tangentially related to the scope of our site, and that for any plagiarized content the poster holds a license from the copyright holder to post and sublicense it as theirs. So there is (hypothetically) no external "legal" problem to address and it all boils down to our own policy.

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This is a partial response, not a complete answer, but I want to provide an update.

You're right that the various policy-related links are not as prominent as they should be. Changing the TOS, even just for something like this, will require notifying everyone, so before we make this change we want to review it to see if there's anything else we need to improve at the same time. We do not intend to change any policies, but if there's other copy-editing that needs to be done, this is the time to do it. (It looks like we should clarify a "may" when we next edit.) We're also reviewing to see if we should say something more about the specific topic you've asked about here, spam accounts where the spam is only in the profile and not also in posts.

Meanwhile, we have added those policy links to the sign-in page. In addition to it being visible for sign-ins in general, this puts those links on the first page a new user sees when responding to the confirmation email. (I started by looking at adding the links to that email, then thought doing it on-site would be better.) This is a small step to address the (lack of) prominence of these links. It's not a complete response.

Spam posts are not welcome, and the existing policy makes that clear. Spam accounts without accompanying spam posts are a gap, as you've noted. On the one hand, if the account never does anything, how much will it be seen? On the other hand, we don't really want to provide "link juice" for spammers. You linked to an answer I wrote about spammers; I had in mind accounts that made spam posts and wasn't thinking of spam profiles at the time I wrote that. The team needs to discuss this more and formalize a policy. We're not ignoring you, and I don't have an answer for you today.

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1 comment thread

Spam accounts with or without accompanying spam posts (14 comments)
Spam accounts with or without accompanying spam posts
Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago

This is a lot of good news for discoverability of current policy.

Re your last paragraph, I clearly need to explain what that "example account" of mine has been doing, because my Q + A posts here were aiming at certain aspects that I wanted to discuss only, while suppressing other aspects sufficiently covered elsewhere. I will describe three or four different types of spam accounts in this comment thread.

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago · edited 27 days ago

Spam account type A keeps posting questions or answers whose text is blatantly promotional and off-topic for the site; if the posts contains hyperlinks, they are equally promotional and off topic for the site (but naturally placed within the promotional post itself).

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago

Spam account type B keeps posting very low quality questions or answers that are nominally on topic, perhaps AI generated, or lazily googled up or consist of generic, unhelpful frame challenges. The true purpose and payload of the disingenious posts are the HYPERLINKS that are blatantly promotional and randomly placed throughout the posts, in no relation to the post text.

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago

Spam account type C keeps posting very low quality questions or answers that are nominally on topic, perhaps AI generated. All their promotional content within our site (almost certainly complete with hyperlinks to the outside) is located in their account profile to which each their post, implicitly and automatically links.

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago

Spam account type D keeps posting very low quality questions or answers that are nominally on topic, perhaps AI generated. All their promotional content within our site is their account name which is chosen to be the (relatively unknown but globally present) brand name they want to promote.

Monica Cellio‭ wrote 27 days ago

Thanks for these examples! Spam account A is the easiest of this lot: if it's only a spammer (no valid posts) you can delete that sucker, or if you think it's redeemable or it has valid posts too, you can suspend. Spam account B sounds like at least a suspension (and editing or deleting the low-quality posts). C and D are where things are not as clear as we'd like, and I thank you for raising this.

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago

All spam account types named so far have many common properties: no trace of any honest contribution to the site, lots of posts, receiving a steady stream of flags and downvotes without any genuine upvotes, an obvious commercial agenda, and a distinct "robotic" feel where they don't seem to truly read anybody else's posts, nor their own.

However, types C and D use indirection and their posted texts, while being pure useless clutter, does not immediately radiate their business agenda. If type C wins any exposure at all, I suppose they win it through SEO rather than through the human users of Codidact sites.

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 27 days ago · edited 27 days ago

The example account I asked this OP about started out as a combination of the D + B types. They received a formal warning specifically about those randomly placed hyperlinks; after receiving the warning, they immediately stopped to include the hyperlinks in their subsequent posts, becoming a pure type D. Unsurprisingly, their account name exactly matched the domain name of every single hyperlink they posted while they were still D + B; this proves that the account name couldn't have been coincidental. A pure D with no such history would be harder to prove in the wild but still notionally possible.

Monica Cellio‭ wrote 27 days ago

Oh, that sounds like a real nuisance! I just took a look at recent flags and it looks like those accounts have been nuked (thanks). I'll see if someone with DB access can spot any common factors (like IP). Next time you get one, feel free to escalate the flag -- admins have a "stronger" nuke option, but if they're using VPNs or are just scattered, that won't help. Doesn't hurt to look, though!

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 26 days ago

Interestingly, type C also has a variety that doesn't even have to post within our network. It has been described here. Somebody might say, this variety is no spammer, they don't post to pages anyone cares about. But it is still parasitic behavior ultimately aimed at gaining exposure (somewhere).

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 26 days ago

Thanks for all your support - I guess I'm currently fine and I understand that I could escalate a flag if the scale required it.

Monica Cellio‭ wrote 26 days ago · edited 26 days ago

I agree that's parasitic behavior and we should make a clear statement about it. Thanks for linking to that staff answer -- good to have on record. And please do ping us or escalate flags if these accounts are frustrating you! We appreciate our volunteer moderators and never want this to be a chore.

Jirka Hanika‭ wrote 24 days ago

Don't worry, I am not frustrated in the least, nor at risk of ever getting. I'm helping out with moderation of a single microscopic site with nearly zero traffic ever, both legit and spam. It's an interesting life experience nevertheless. I find Codidact's software surprisingly robust and feature rich and thoughtfully designed to help me in every situation I might encounter at the current scale. It's just that I don't use Discord a lot and so I tend to ask the few policy questions I might ever have at meta, to learn from more experienced moderators, users, or staff, and maybe more importantly, to improve the discoverability of the policy for everyone.

Monica Cellio‭ wrote 24 days ago

I agree with asking policy questions on Meta where they are more visible and discoverable! I've tried to find needles in the Discord haystack, and it's very hit-or-miss at least for me. And nobody's going to casually notice it after it scrolls out of view there.